Link Exchange

[zuzus_garden]

There is so much to discuss about link exchange!

So, to keep our questions, ideas, and suggestions about links from getting lost, here's a thread dedicated to talkin' Links!

:)
Zuzu

[zuzus_garden]

Hi all!

I would LOVE to hear what everyone thinks about how to set up a link page.

I am currently using banner links w/ alt tags. In a split second my customers can get an idea of the content and quality of a site, and mousing-over (is mousing-over even a word???) the banner displays that site’s description. I set my links page up this way as a convenience to my customers, and a lil’ boost for my link exchange partners even though it takes me more time to set it up. My banner links are not in alphabetical order, but in an order that seems more relevant.

My second favorite way to see a links page is text links with descriptive text next to it. This looks nice on the page, and gives a little information about each business, but it takes additional time to read each link before deciding to visit.

One of my link partners, Sharon, at The Christmas Keeper (http://thechristmaskeeper.com/) , uses text links with descriptive text, but she has also taken the time to create directories which help customers to find what they are most interested in. I really like the way she has set up her links page, and as I add more links, I’m thinking I would like to try using this idea.

My least favorite links page is when just the site names are listed in alpha order with no clue as to what the site is about. It may be the easiest way for a business to add links, but it is the least helpful to visiting customers and link partners.

There are conversations in other forums that search engines will rate text links, but not banner links.

As small business owners we need to promote our sites and boost our search engine ratings. But, I would like to do this in a way that provides helpful and relevant links for my customers to visit, and that also helps boost traffic to my link partner's sites.

Please share! I would love to hear what you think.

Zuzu

[Kathy Ann]

I used to do it with logos. My friends would provide their own GIF or, with permission, I would go to their site and capture something.

[administrator]

Zuzu,
You're absolutely correct, Google in particular uses the number of links to a page to help determine ranking. Google has a built-in link checker.

For your site, the following text typed into the Google search field will return Web pages linking to yours.

link:www.ren-prod-inc.com/zuzus_garden/index.shtml

The syntax is:
link:www.yoursite.com

[zuzus_garden]

Thanks, Rex. I'm still trying to get a handle on this...

Banners alone are simply images. Google does not index images. As I understand it, if the images have alt-tags, then the text in the alt-tag is indexed.

Currently, my alt-tags just have the descriptions. So, do I need to go back and add the www linkpartners_site.com to the alt-tag?

Anyone, anyone?

Thanks!

Zuzu

[zuzus_garden]

And Rex said
For your site, the following text typed into the Google search field will return Web pages linking to yours.
link:www.ren-prod-inc.com/zuzus_garden/index.shtml

I entered www.ren-prod-inc.com/zuzus_garden/index.shtml in Google's search window, and then selected Find web pages that link to ren-prod-inc.com/zuzus_garden/index.shtml.

Only 6 unique sites displayed (including Cottage Living), whereas I have 35 reciprocal link partners. Can you please explain why?

Zuzu

[administrator]

Zuzu's Garden,

If a site that is linking to you has not been indexed by Google, then the link will not show up on the report. Also, the Google spiders must go through every page on the internet, sometimes it takes them a while to update the links data.

I'm not certain, but I don't think url's inside alt tags help page placement or search results.

[zuzus_garden]

I'm not so sure of the quality of the Google Link Report Tool. :confused: It shows 6 links.

When I do a Google search for Zuzu's Garden, I find links to my site 17 times within the first 40 hits.

When I do a Google search for my description Handcrafted garden-inspired home accents and gifts that bring the beauty of nature indoors, I find 8 links to my site.

Not all of my link partners have included my description. But most of my link partners have had a link to my site for months, so they should have been indexed by now.

Still confused and looking for answers. :(

Zuzu

[zuzus_garden]

OK, did a little testing. I have the Google Toolbar (http://toolbar.google.com/), so that helped figure out what's going on.

When I searched for Zuzu's Garden, this is the order of returned links:
1) My link
2) Sites with the highest Google Page Rank display first in the search returns (6 down to 2 showed up)

Sites that never displayed a link to Zuzu's Garden:
1) Sites with a 0 ranking (brand new site not indexed yet)
2) Sites that have just added my link and are not indexed yet
3) Sites that have only the banner (no alt-text)
4) Broken links (2 sites are no longer out there!)
5) Buried links (must hunt to find links)
6) Sites with tons of banner links w/ alt-tags

So, if I go back to my original question...I think the answer may be that the best way to set up a links page is Text Links with Descriptions. I've got some more work to do! :rolleyes:

Tell me what you think!

Zuzu

[greenoak]

:) zu zu noticed the long sentence you put in for google....would anybody really put all that in? im racking my brain to figure out what one or 2 words someone who would like my store would put in...so hard...


my main chat home is country sampler...country business retailer forum...a great place and laid out so nice and so easy to use....anyway those country stores and web sellers are just dedicated to links...they almost all use them...might want to go look..

i cant quite see it for my store...but i dont do a lot of internet...but if you are selling dolls why would you want to send customers to 20 other doll sellers? guess if you are all internet its worth it for who might get sent to you..

.also i think your cottage sites are a lot more diverse and interesting that the country sites...they are so much alike its awful...i express that once in a while over there on the country business forum....lol...


ann

www.greenoakantiques.com

[zuzus_garden]

Hi Ann,

Oh, I would not expect anyone to to type in ‘Handcrafted garden-inspired home accents and gifts that bring the beauty of nature indoors’ as a Google search! I was searching on that text to identify which of my link partners would show up in the search, because they have included my description as well as my biz name, Zuzu’s Garden.

If someone typed in ‘nature gifts’ as a Google search, then only sites that included my description would show up. That’s why I redid my links page to text links with descriptions – so my partners’ sites will show up in Google searches.

You asked...
but if you are selling dolls why would you want to send customers to 20 other doll sellers?

To help our customers find what they are looking for, and at the same time support each other in business. That Miracle on 34th Street Macy’s-Gimbles philosophy. :D

My site looks different because my hubby wrote the software. Our three sites do not look identical because our stores are different, but they use the same basic software that he wrote. He's getting it ready to offer it to others who want web sites that handle the sale of unique items, have the PayPal shopping cart nightmare already figured out, handles discount codes, etc.

Zuzu

[greenoak]

zuzu..im kind of mixed up on the google discussions...but i can learn..if we ever try online in a bigger way...we mostly worry about meta tags...

you make me giggle....my world is so much different than the macys and gimbles...my friends hope i dont make it to the auctions...lol


and some of my dearest wholesale customers brag right to me that they would never tell anyone about our store.... i take it as a compliment and dont expect more...its what they call in the antique world ...your fishing hole...you never tell..


love your butterflys..


ann
www.greenoakantiques.com
.....

[Kathy Ann]

Meta tags are not real. Most search engines can't find them. Just write your content with the seeker in mind and they will find you.

[greenoak]

we do get 700 hits a week...and have been on line maybe 3 yrs...

i try to tell my webmeister the hints i get on line....but what do you mean by write your content.?...
this is the first time ive heard of meta tags not being important...

ann
www.greenoakantiques.com

[Kathy Ann]

Google ignores metas. Lots of others do too. By content, I mean writing the item descriptions, policies, site news, whatever you type... in a way that uses a lot of the keywords and key phrases people might type into a search engine while shopping for your items. That includes sticky problems like common misspellings, brand names (such as "Kleenex" or "Jacuzzi" when they really just want tissues or a hot tub) and regional naming differences (like "grinder", "sub", or "Italian sandwich", which can all mean the same thing)

[greenoak]

thanks kathy ann...one more question is that in the hidden part or the visible part?

ann

[Kathy Ann]

Visible, fer sure!

[zuzus_garden]

Like, Kathy Ann,

You do a great job of explaining all of this. I went to a lot of different sites to gather this info, and you explain it in a matter of a few sentences. Fer sure! :cool:

What I read recently, is that the title is important and used in search engine algorithms, the description is still used by a few search engines, and the keywords are no longer useful, like.

The best advice I've read is what Kathy Ann has shared. Write the content that shows up on your pages in a way that is helpful to customers, but that includes the keywords - words that a customer would type in when searching for the products you sell.

Zu

[Kathy Ann]

I got rid of all my hidden text because I read that the search engines can tell, and they see it as keyword spamming. So now I have it visible as a list, but I'm not sure if it would still be seen as spamming or not.

[zuzus_garden]

I've read that hidden text (like white text on a white background) is a major no-no. I've seen lists at the bottom of the page at other sites and was wondering if that's ok. Haven't come across any info on that yet.

But, here I am talking about SEO in the Link Exchange thread. :rolleyes: Guess we need to start an SEO thread, and continue talkin' there.

Zuzu

[Kathy Ann]

Mine still looks like a litany, so I'm not sure how to handle it.

[Kathy Ann]

Hey, does Cottage Living encourage links?

[zuzus_garden]

Not sure what you mean, Kathy Ann. Rex set things up so that if we use our url in our signature, we will show up in search results.

If you are asking does CL exchange recip links, you'd need to PM Rex to find out.

Zuzu

[Kathy Ann]

Good idea Zu, I'll do that! Maybe the magazine has an affiliate program or something. I don't expect that they would link to us, though.

[Alicia]

Hi Kathy Anne,
Beautiful products. But there is a problem with how you set up the page.. I right clicked on your home page an clicked on view source-- Here is where all your html resides-- all the info the robots and spiders use to index your site.. There are no listings for meta tags and keywords on your home page. None of the search engines will ever find you.
On the top of your Home page you don't have a title and a special key word that refers to your product in text form.

You also need to link more with compatible sites.

Alicia
http://www.AliciaTappDesigns.com

[Kathy Ann]

I will look into that Alicia, but in fact meta tags are falling out of favor with the search engines. Google doesn't use them at all anymore. Of course it can't hurt to have them for the search engines that still do. I thought I had filled in the meta information for the index page in Microsoft Frontpage, but I'll go back thru and see why it's left out. I wonder if it matters that the links have to be on compatible sites? I'm not necessarily trying to draw hits with my links, as much as show up under keyword searches. (Dunno why, I am sewing my brains out as it is!:p) Some of my links are affiliations, but in fact I don't know anyone who has ever actually received money from those.:rolleyes:

[zuzus_garden]

Kathy Ann said I'm not necessarily trying to draw hits with my links, as much as show up under keyword searches.

I am surprised how many people have come to visit my site from my link partners' sites, so it certainly can help that way.

Link exchange will help your SEO, and will help your keyword searches only if your link partners have set up their links correctly.

Banners alone are useless.

Banners w/ alt tags that include your keywords will be found if there aren't a lot of banners on their site.

If you want your site to show up in keyword searches w/ something other than your business name, you need to ask your link partners to set up text links w/ descriptions that use your keywords, and you need to do the same for them.

Otherwise, link exchange will not help.

Zu

[Kathy Ann]

Good ponts Zuzu. I just went thru and captioned all the recip link banners on my index page. I have been focusing less on compatibility because Alicia's entrance into this conversation really rocked my world. Outbound linking was a new concept to me and I have been trying to catch up on it this past week. In fact I have to sew all day today to make up for it! :p

Here is an article I found. http://www.webcredible.co.uk/user-friendly-resources/search-engine-optimisation/number-links.shtml

[Casual Cottage]

I am surprised how many people have come to visit my site from my link partners' sites, so it certainly can help that way.

Zu
Hello All,
I just discovered something else about link exchanges that I didn't know. In checking my hits for yesterday, I noticed that I received a hit from someone using Google. They searched for :"Floral Garden"+dinnerware. I was curious since I don't think I have any of that wording on my site. I followed the link and found the following on the 11-20 page of Google:

Our Favorite Sites... Mailboxes painted with realistic floral, garden and other decorative & garden ... Selection of dinnerware by Russell Wright, Blue Ridge and Noritake, ...
www.casualcottage.com/links.html - 32k - Cached - Similar pages

These are an outbound links on my links page. Now obviously, if someone is looking for dinnerware and click on this link, they will find that I don't carry any on my site, but they might look around the site and see something they like.

Apparently, both outbound and inbound links can help get us noticed.

[zuzus_garden]

Hi Marilyn -

I spent time figuring out the best way to set up my links page, and shared it at the beginning of this thread, but I guess I didn't do a very good job of explaining.

Because your links are text links with descriptions, the customer visited your site from the search results from you link partner's description, maybe took some time to look around, then went to your link partner's site and may have found what they were looking for - thinking how great it was that you helped them find what they were looking for.


Everyone -

That's what I meant when I wrote that link exchange is about helping customers find what they are looking for, and at the same time support each other in business. That Miracle on 34th Street Macy’s-Gimbles philosophy.

People that set up their link pages any other way are missing out on these opportunities!

Zuzu

P.S. I worked in software development for years as a Quality Assurance Test Engineer discovering problems in web site applications and ensuring that they were fixed. That's the background that sent me looking for answers on link exchange. :)

[Casual Cottage]

Hi Marilyn -

I spent time figuring out the best way to set up my links page, and shared it at the beginning of this thread, but I guess I didn't do a very good job of explaining.




Hi Zuzu,
I have always thought of links as someone visiting the link page of one of my link partners, seeing my link and visiting my site. I didn't realize that keywords used to find one of my link partners could point back to my site from the search engine. I know that you also mentioned text links that are alphabetized not making it easy for customers to find what they're looking for. My website doesn't give me the flexibility to categorize my links. One more reason for having Joyce build my website for me! :)

[zuzus_garden]

Hi Marilyn,

I added my directories a couple weeks ago. You can see them here...

Zuzu's Garden Link Page (http://www.ren-prod-inc.com/zuzus_garden/zuzus_links.shtml)

All I did was add this code...

<center><font size=4><b>Collectibles</b></font></center>

and then move my links under the correct directory headings. You might be able to go into your source code, and add directories yourself!

You said I know that you also mentioned text links that are alphabetized not making it easy for customers to find what they're looking for. That's only if the web site sets up link partners with just the name...no description...there is no way to know what the site is about unless you visit it. Frankly, if I see a lot of link names A-Z w/o descriptions, I skip visiting because it's too time consuming to visit each and every site.

I do not alphabetize my links, but move the positioning of the links around every once and awhile so that my link partners can all get a chance to be first. (Comes from having a biz name that starts w/ a 'Z'). Because the descriptions are included, it's easy to read them and decide which sites to visit.

:)

Zuzu